Socionics - the16types.info forums

I have struggled with understanding this concept for years. However, after actually buying a puzzle game - Spock's Logic Puzzle Box (which I highly recommend) - I think I know the difference! With this in mind, who would then be thinking type: 'Spock' - with his rational, objective analysis for whom feelings cloud all logic. Who would then be feeling type: 'McCoy' - who is guided by emotion at the expense of all rationality. I therefore find that thinking types are often confused with feeling types who are guided by strong negative emotions. Stormy, aggressive feelings used to shoot down others who have positive feelings, or those who you simply don't like should actually be considered a function of feeling. Why? Because thinking is about maintaining objectivity regardless of how you feel. If you have extraverted thinking, you don't let your feelings get in the way of your objective, factual analysis of people and things. Therefore, you might strongly dislike someone, but if the facts say that they are right, you will politely take their side. If you have introverted thinking, feelings are put aside in favour of a subjective analysis of a situation. Just like with extraverted thinking - you may not like someone, but you will admit that they are right because their ideas ring true for you. Also, if thinking is your strongest function, it is not just that emotions are put aside in favour of thinking - they actually get in the way of any type of objective analysis, and you therefore have strong distaste for them. I have now realized that I have some access to introverted thinking. However, I have seen way too many times in this theory people who are just filled with negativity and abuse being called 'thinking types' because they have strong negative emotions. If someone is a 'thinking type', their emotions would actually get in the way of their objective logic and analysis - including any negative emotions. I therefore think that typing such people as 'thinking types' is a mistake. What do you think?

This is a thread about how Van Gogh sucks. If you think Van Gogh is actually good, you may start another thread for your falsehoods, but you may not post them here.

Stupid Bullshit "Fake" Van Gogh Turns Out to Be Just a Real Van Gogh

These are the things I've learned about the American Military-Industrial Complex so far:

1. It is basically an entire parallel society, massive, and nearly completely separated from "civilian" life (though a large number of its members are "civilian military employees.") The military isn't marching around proudly in any significant unnamed location where you're not, yet it's still huge.
2. It is basically waging nonstop wars for the sake of wars and the economy like the ones in 1984 but on a less dystopian scale.
3. Being as closed off and outright bizarre as it is, it has a very, very cultish "corporate culture," which the rules "don't post on social media" and "don't participate in politics" only scratch the surface of.
4. Most of its members have social credit score ratings translating to Ds and Fs, and many more legal and financial issues than the civilian population. This seems like the main fact social credit has to contend with and/or leverage to establish itself in America. If social credit amounts to a dystopia, yet manages to rein in the military-industrial complex, there will be huge problems. Most probably, it would simply blackmail them into working for the sake of social credit owners/shareholders and make the public think that they're somehow neutralized just because there are no more forever wars. Alternatively, having heroic soldiers could prevent social credit from taking hold in America, but this would be like cleaning the Augean stables if they're going to be genuinely heroic people.

However, I'm glad I got this window into the bizarre and vile parallel sector of America more generally.

Title. Also I am not very good at giving gifts and generally prefer time over presents. However, I would actually like to give her a gift. Any EIEs, IEIs, SLEs and LSIs to give me advice?

Okay guys, I am going to go a little bit emotionally intimate here. I am currently dating an SLI and there's this SEE guy who keeps on hitting on her like hard, and I am just there feeling some really uncomfortable emotions. I am not sure if this is jealousy, or if this is due to my immaturity (I am only 16, after all) but I do feel a sense of protectorship/some sort of possesiveness. Like my boy teenage brain goes apeshit all of the sudden. Do you guys feel the same, and what should I do? Lastly, what would you do?

Sorry for this guys.

Hello, I am a new member of this forum and decided to come here in order to learn more about Socionics.

i've narrowed him down to an extroverted beta- sle or eie
he's more expressive and pretty much never says anything offensive. compared to some other sles i know so i'm leaning towards eie but he's also impulsive and sparky. no obvious si polr. but no hint of fi polr either. anyway it's been bothering me lately.
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hahahaha i feel so weird uploading this picture. probably deleting this thread after i got a few responses.
help me internet strangers. 4d fe or 2d??

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Hey guys my friends call me rumby, roombi, rambi, roomba or anything that sounds vaguely similar.

I'm enfp and my ennegram has been going through major changes lately. Thanks for adding me!

Change my mind.

For what it's worth, New Age religions are poison too.

I think monotheistic religions are just a power grab by imperialists. I don't even see evidence for monotheism in the official texts of alleged monotheistic religions. For example, the Bible used by Christians refers to angels, demons, and people with special blessings or curses as actual gods, and not only idols as ironic fake gods. Islam has one "God," but God isn't even considered a spiritual being but some sort of essence. An essence is not really a god, or every religion called polytheist would be monotheistic: Brahma, Krishna, Shiva, or Kali in different versions of Hinduism, Zeus or Chaos in Hellenism, Odin in Asatru, Buddha in Buddhism (as in Buddha consciousness) etc. The fact is 100% of religious texts have some kind of fractal ontology. Superstitious polytheistic beliefs are followed by hicks and seem to be harmless to everyone who doesn't actually subscribe to them, but superstitious monotheistic beliefs gnaw at civilization itself. Non-superstitious beliefs follow the structure I described above. Change my mind.

I'm really serious.

When people were trying to keep Trump from being President, the insult hurled at him was "Drumpf." Drumpf is just a kind of silly-looking German name... like most German names. The only other German presidents we've had are Eisenhower and Hoover, and they tried to pretend to be WASPs, unlike Trump. Trump also gets compared to Hitler all the time people aren't making fun of his hair, skin color, hands, or other body parts, and the official Trump biography says he resembles "Elvis and Mephistopheles." Now, Trump is incredibly ill-mannered, but Nixon was way worse and didn't get any flak until Watergate, and many others are similar. I think people hate Trump for not being a WASP. Obama's white half was WASP. Trump is 0% WASP. People don't just want third-generation immigrants as President, especially when they're German, and especially when they don't even pretend to be a WASP. I just wrote a poem about Trump Derangement Syndrome which I'm going to rework and I noticed every other line turned into something about Nazis, the Faust myth, or making fun of his name (the rest were making fun of his appearance or listing his supposed crimes.) Aside from Trump being very rude I'm not sure what's so horrible about him, though I'm not a Trump supporter either. People have insulted me, then when I insulted them back, they called me Trump even though I grabbed zero pussies or any other body parts and made no cabinet appointments questionable or not. I said Trump was President and they weren't, and also said Trump seemed much nicer than them despite being a rude person. Even if Trump is not very good I still suspect the 24/7 Trump Show is about him not being a WASP or assimilating to WASP culture. Having a 100% non-WASP President is much more shocking than having a half-black WASP or a raised Catholic WASP (Kennedy, incidentally assassinated) basically.

I still don't see what Trump did that's so horrible. There's no war with Iran and he's not drone bombing civilians like Obama or anything else that seems horrible other than spelling coverage as covfefe. That's horrific.

Greetings everyone, I am Vee, I dont know my sociotype, thats why I joined here and this is a post I should post lol

Him getting lectured by LSE boomer Joe Budden, lol

I’m seeing a clash between democratic and aristocratic values in this part especially

I am a new member here. Nice to meet you all. My MBTI type? Maybe INTP but I am not 100% sure.

I already know that my type is SLI. But in this video we were thinking LSI. I'm interested to hear your guys' thoughts.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f5vLUROm-WU

Delete [Duplicate Post]

Hello all. I'm new to the site and looking to learn more about socionics in general and my particular type INTJ/LII. Psychology in general is one of my main interests.

A little more about me. I enjoy video games and puzzle solving in general. I prefer non-fiction books for the most part, but I have enjoyed a few detective mysteries in the past.

Thanks for having me.

Member Questionnaire 1 (The Unmentionable)

What is beauty? What is love?

Beauty is the correlation between an objective external object and how it is seen and interpreted by the subjective vision. Beauty is the projection of the objective object on the subjective canvas. Love is something our brain developed in order to stimulate us to procreate and make a relationship enjoyable while procreating: Just like we have wonderful dreams and visions when we are about to die, we have a great sensation and attachment when we love. These are mechanisms developed by the brain to make useful experiences enjoyable (or in love's case, potentially destructive too)

What are your most important values?

This question is hard to answer without context, one of the things I look for in myself and others is an awareness that we do not just have a social side, but an individual side either. I wish people could understand that diverging attention from individual development can be just as dangerous as social isolation in the long term. This is because it is evident that after time your capacity to deal with things individually becomes inhibited due to the prolonged contact with an environment that has solving things together as a goal, it is natural for a person to converge to others and actually seek guidance within another person, but wen this becomes too emancipated then you could dangerously inhibit individual needs like solitude, self-reflection, and a correct assessment of goals and capabilities. Research shows that social environments strengthen your capacities to deal with situations and your self-esteem, which are both good things to an extent: the extent in which this prevents you from seeing your weaknesses and shortcomings, hence preventing you to improve your weaknesses and rather looking for someone that fills them in, a very inefficient and risky method in my opinion.
Another value I have is the value of teaching people to think and how to correctly fix contradictions and implement their plans. In this world we are all very unaware of life and its mechanisms, we tend to have a generic idea of what's around us when we look at people and the status quo; what we people see is nothing but the image of the status quo: why ponder on changing things when we have people to socialize with, "I don't care about this egghead stuff I seek sensation" seems to be a recurring monologue in this society especially with teens. In adulthood it becomes "I have a job to do, taxes to pay and money to earn. Pondering about something I can't change is of no use and won't help me on feeding my family". This is what I call inhibited living, society is discarding opportunities of improvement to run itself by making people aim for what society conveniently rewards them for, most people do not seem to understand that everything is related with something else which means there are solutions in society that work better than others. One of my values is to cure this sense of living while unaware of your reality and teaching people to see it in its entirety. possibly a sociological approach combined with rational philosophy. Society should focus more of its incomes towards research and development since just like any machine, society can be constantly improved.
The last value I am mentioning is the value of facing your limitations: Another trend within this society is that we often give our people choices that distract them from seeing their own limits and the limits of society in general, there are too many things like advertisements, TV shows and trends that distract us from the real problems with our nature and our society. I believe that with intelligence, analysis and action we can overcome our limits and propel ourselves into an optimal future. But the reality of things is that we live inhibited, unaware of what surrounds us other than people, money and present sensations, and in the entire history of mankind, this has always been a problem to the point change had to assert itself through war, revolution and death. I agree that war can help to improve things but it is preferable it doesn't get to that level of risk now since we have some very dangerous weapons called nuclear bombs.
If you live in a society, be aware of how you live in it and how you can use this knowledge in the most efficient way. I follow this in my own life too: If something is preventing me from reaching my goals, I will try to eliminate/reprocess it

Do you have any sort of spiritual/religious beliefs, and why do you hold (or don't) those beliefs in the first place?

My only spiritual belief is that society factually isn't what it could be. God is irrelevant and a minor problem in a society where the only problem is its alleged creation. If there is a god, he clearly doesn't want us to know the truth. None of what we consider to be god is really god since it is infinitely unlikely in all possibilities to be the right choice. I can't know who god is because he might not even be there or might even control us in order not to know, I am not interested to know who god is it doesn't change anything in my life as I would still have goals to pursue. I am what you could consider as agnostic.

Opinion on war and militaries? What is power to you?

War is sociologically inevitable and technologically constructive, It is although undeniably dangerous nowadays because of the nuclear bomb. This is a problem because oppressing war would halt history and halt the competition that drives progress and innovation in mankind (progress is a mere result of two opposing forces) but declaring it could be equally as destructive. The only possibly rewarding (but pretty risky nonetheless) war today could be cold war situations, where two powerful nations compete themselves towards rapid technological advancement (Russia says: I sent a man-made object into space. US says: Nice job! I sent a man on the moon.) In spite of this I would, at least in the current state of events, cut the budget of the military and redirect it towards space exploration and research. I see space exploration and medical research as more efficient, less risky and more profitable courses of action for the long term.

What have you had long conversations about? What are your interests? Why?

I recall having long conversations about my selective interests which are obviously societal misconceptions, friendship, solitude, science fiction, potential technological advancements and ideal society. I also like to debate trends, movies and inner landscapes I created. I am a little less interested in mass consensus issues like abortion, genders, etc...
I go to the library three days a week in order to isolate distractions and focus on my study. I do this because studying and taking in knowledge trains your brain and sharpens your attention span. I also do it because it puts me into closer contact with my goals and allows me to fully implement study. In a normal relaxation day (If I have no tests or more important goals) I usually focus on my personal hobbies: I look at skyline pictures, watch movies which help me detach from reality, and look up typology stuff. I play rugby and am active in a band. My personal interests are selective and not easily updated, they are of course Architecture, math, philosophy, sociology. I have these interests because they develop my understanding and analytical eye skills. I selected these to plan my career and know which ones to pursue first in great detail. I also have a sweet spot for technological innovations, science fiction, space exploration and any positive improvement in general. Hobbies include music, creating inner universes and stories, walking in nature and online debating topics of interest. I also like to spend time with my family and talk with teachers.

Interested in health/medicine as a conversation topic? Are you focused on your body?

I am rarely in tune with my body and am not interested in the health sector in itself, I can show curiosity and interest in its potential uses and its field technological innovations (new cures/treatments, new tech, funding of medical research, etc...) the fields I am particularly interested in is stem cell research, new cures for cancer, new discoveries, better treatments and prosthetic technology.
As far as my focus on my body is concerned aside from ext. appearance I only tend to be focused on my body when one part is sending a signal from it (ache or spasm) in which case I can rarely determine the source of it and may end up browsing the internet for it if the ache is intense or prolonged, which only helps to increase the anxiety I already had. I am very unaware of what goes on inside my body and can be more focused on what it shows outside.

What do you think of daily chores?

I usually find them pointless in spite of liking order and easy access to things (I get angry when I can't find something instantly) I tend to like organizing my books and cleaning up my shelves periodically but have little interest in cleaning, washing and putting away books and clothes (why should I categorize school books for subjects when I have different subjects everyday?, putting them into a separate archive is only going to hinder the speed of me getting what I need) (Why should I hang or put away my clothes? I always wear the same) I often find chores useless and see them as my last priority since I tend to dedicate more time to online research/browsing topics of interest, studying and more important goals for my long term future. In my life, long term comes before short term.

Books or films you liked? Recently read/watched or otherwise. Examples welcome.

Movies provide a means to escape in my inner world and emotions, their visual effects and plots are often an inspiration for the latter if I really like them. Most if not all movies are within the Science Fiction genre. I really like Bladerunner, The Matrix Franchise, Alien Franchise, AI-Artificial Intelligence, Star Trek, Nightmare Franchise (rare non sci-fi entry), Interstellar, The Martian, Star Wars . Most of the movies I like have a vision of the future in it.
I have recently watched Bladerunner and Alien Covenant.

What has made you cry? What has made you smile? Why?

Cry: self-doubt, failed project/deadline, failure in general.
Smile: Family, success, perfection.

Where do you feel: at one with the environment/a sense of belonging?

I feel at one with the environment when I am in familiar places or in nature: I love the world when I see either technologically advanced cities or beautiful landscapes such as mountain woods and lakes. I feel a sense of belonging when I efficiently convey my ideas and when I manage to convince someone, I feel like I belong when something words out as it is intended to and I have fun doing it.

What have people seen as your weaknesses? What do you dislike about yourself?

The most common critics are that I am distracted, disorganized and lacking the practical application of my knowledge. I am very often seen and see myself as lacking self-esteem, lazy, being overly selective with relationships and always looking at what differentiates me from others. I do not really see my reserved nature as a weakness since friendship has few opportunities to begin with. Neither do I see myself as disorganized as I tend to carefully make schedules, plans and lists, I think that this perceived disorganization is the outward presentation of what actually is distraction and a failure to see certain missing details; I more often than not tend to plan things in my mind or on my personal diary. What I actually see as my weaknesses are the shy attempts of implementation, my laziness and lack of concretization of my theories. I also see my explosiveness and intolerance with family as something that must be cured and controlled, I wish I could control my negative emotions like I do with strangers and express my thoughts concisely and neutrally.

What have people seen as your strengths? What do you like about yourself?

Like I said in the previous answer, I get complimented for being very aware of my goals, perfectionist and looking for general rules in everything. because of these I am often called as resolute, intelligent and inquisitive (In reality I only inspect what is within my personal interests and goals). My perfectionism, attention to future goals and analytical eye I like that I at least try to make sense of the society I live in and am able to detach myself from the present sensation. I also pride myself of being capable of being alone for extended periods of time and my creative skills ( I have used my imagination to make an entire mental universe that completely fits together like a puzzle and it even has its own timeline and events) In spite of being called chaotic and disorganized I think I am actually pretty good at finding ways to solve problems and reach goals. The hard thing is almost always implementation.

In what areas of your life would you like help?

Everything concerning the theoretical process is easily managed by my logic and experience, I have no problem defining where to go and tracing a path to get there. I would like help in order to control my emotions (especially my anger) and improve my self-esteem. This would help me overcome subjective burdens and make me implement more things, emotional support and people reminding me of my goals and plans often motivate me to start implementing things and plans, I would have much more use in that rather than people telling me to socialize more often than necessary. Compliments such as calling me intelligent, competent and objective instantly motivates me to implement things. Even though I often tend to doubt whether I deserve these compliments later on.

Ever feel stuck in a rut? If yes, describe the causes and your reaction to it.

This is an unhealthy state for me to be in: When this happens, I usually tend to isolate myself and read fiction which allows my mental inner universe to take control of my practical outer life: when there is a story that captures my interest, I may delve into it and adapt it to fit it into my world, if strong this can take control of my school and study routines, causing me to feel extremely detached from my goals and future plans. The mental universe which is often creatively and constructively healthy and helpful, becomes a burden to my plans. During this state it can also happen I stop caring about my projects and end up delving into pointless distractions: I may give up on my opinions, sleep or binge watch tv, diverging from study. I remain stuck in my feelings and world and am usually much more distracted, impatient, inflexible, inefficient, expressive, emotional and aggressive. People see something is wrong as my attention span decreases to alarming levels (it has happened I couldn't keep focused for more than 5 minutes on the task) and my emotions become clearly visible.

What qualities do you most like and dislike in other people? What types do you get along with?

In other people, I like constructive behavior, honesty, intelligence, objectivity, indifference towards social codes and standards, friendliness, resolute and logical people. I can get along with people with similar interests and a tendency towards debate, analysis and talking about future goals and interests. Reserved people who are philosophically and sociologically or mathematically inclined tend to attract me. I dislike rudeness, privacy inhibition, touchiness, invasion of personal space, attention to standards or norms, comparative explanations, subjectively emphasized conversations over reflection, excessive emotional expression and trends oriented people.
I am indifferent towards meme sharing even though I would have more fun talking about constructive concepts and interests

How do you feel about romance/sex? What qualities do you want in a partner?

I cannot express my opinion about this, all I can say is that romance must be pure and confirmed to last. It mustn't be restricted by social norms but it shouldn't also be shown everywhere in public, because of the moral mature of romance being a private show of affection between two individuals.
In a partner I want the same qualities of a friend but would like more traits that complete me: A rational person inclined towards philosophical discussion, but grounded enough to make me implement things and stimulate me through trips in nature and cities which cultivate my inner universe. I would also like a person that could see the hidden attachment behind my reserved and sometimes verbally aggressive behavior: a person that could help me apply fix rather than finding ways to fix.

If you were to raise a child, what would be your main concerns, what measures would you take, and why?

My main concern would mainly be how to properly allow this child to relate to society: this would be trying to prevent unhealthy conditions of either excessive socialization or excessive unhealthy isolation. Judging from his interests I would suggest ways and strategies to deal with life according to his own standards rather than the standards of the mass and society (I do not support parents that take the standard as a point of reference for a child's decision) This is because his introduction in a healthy group is not possible if he is unaware of his own decisions and himself from a tender age.

A friend makes a claim that clashes with your current beliefs. What is your inward and outward reaction?

If it is a friend we are talking about, I would be assuming this person earned his position in my selective inner circle and is there because he is rational, smart, open and insightful. I would gladly debate the topic with him and discuss about it whilst trying to keep it civil and constructive.

Describe your relationship to society. How do you see people as a whole? What do you consider a prevalent social problem? Name one.

I usually see society as an ill being, it is heavily overcrowded, irrational, unaware of its own mechanisms, polluted both morally and physically; filled with unawareness, sentimentalism, excessive harmony (forced harmony); dominated by mass media and potentially manipulated information. Society is individually inhibited, dogmatic, close, potential wasting, resource wasting and last but not least inhibiting and illusory.
The bad thing about this is that society could actually THINK and wake up from this ill state by funding research, development and education, But this is going to of no economic use in a society where 80% of people's greatest aspiration is to make friends rather than contributing in real progress through thought and studying (most people go to university to get a stable job rather than contributing to future research). I envision a society that could be incredibly advanced both technologically and morally that all modern concepts would be basically useless there, basically a technological utopia where society is individually and collectively efficient (through time, we have always wavered in between being efficient in only one of these) with quick, controlled technological advancement. individuals in this society are either contributing in a group or individually, through their own research like the age of enlightenment and the scientific revolution. But the reality is that this is never going to happen in the current generations, today's youth is too inhibited individually and thus socially with everything that is around it: we do not want change because we can't even see what we have got to begin with; we can't see a future since we aren't even able to understand the present and where it came from: we only perceive it and feel it. People are alienated both collectively and individually, and the people that actually reflect and think are an excruciatingly painful minority.
The biggest societal problem is our limited awareness, which reflects in a constant fear of solitude, problems, limitations and thinking about them to solve them.

How do you choose your friends and how do you behave around them?

I choose friends through a very selective checklist: if this person is too attached, I will avoid contact and if this person is, like me, unwilling to maintain initiative the relationship will destruct itself. a dull, forcibly conforming, poorly interested and poorly aware condition makes it easy for me to avoid you and dislike you since our approach is too different. Making noise rather than sound statements is also a great way to keep me away from sharing things with you.
Around friends I usually appear as sarcastic, goofy but serious and rational at the same time. Interactions depend on the fitting checks on my checklist (with one goofy acquaintance I may often sarcastically joke whilst occasionally talking about future plans while with someone else I will purely approach to discuss something intellectually)

How do you behave around strangers?

I am usually outwardly calm, impassive, reserved, collected and polite. In such contexts I tend to listen rather than talk and prefer not throwing myself in emotional expression or revealing my world views through debate. In normal conversation with strangers I may tend to drop hints about my perception of the world and my life but rarely fully reveal what I do unless I have to. When in conflict with strangers I tend to be more diplomatic and permissive and may find compromises. Because of this I can be seen as sarcastic and goofy.

How the Thinking Functions are like Spock

Van Gogh Sucks

Future

The Military-Industrial Complex

What gift should I give for my EIE friend? I got her for my Secret Santa.

Do any other Delta's feel intense jealousy whenever their SO is being hit upon?

New on 16types

Thurston Moore

v.i. this guy please

Howdy

Offset

Monotheistic Religions are Poison

Trump Hate = Germanophobia?

hi

Lil Yachty

Hello

Type me based on this video interview

Type me based on this video interview

Hello there

Member Questionnaire (The Unmentionable)