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Criminal records

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I wouldn't want somebody with a criminal record to be responsible for the well-being of my son.

I think it's bullshit that if someone has a criminal record, they're coerced into further crime because they're denied housing and other money-making opportunities.

Both of these things are true, and one obvious place that my opinions lead is to prevent people who have hurt others from being responsible for others. But overall I haven't fleshed out every detail about where I stand, and I'm curious if you have? Please talk about it k

My reason for creating this thread is that I heard today that after a certain period of time like 2 years, the risk that someone with a criminal record poses is less than that of a non offender. I lack further details and I haven't researched for myself, so I don't vouch for this.

Laughing at CWC

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What do you think of laughing at CWC? While on the one hand he brings to mind interesting questions about the role of free will vs. fate, if we can't laugh at someone ejaculating all over his oversized clay Sonichu necklace and showing everyone, calling black people "niggos" after getting called out for saying the real word many times and only wanting to date "Aryans," or self-identifying as a male non-homosexual lesbian to try to circumvent an alleged conspiracy on the part of Virginia to keep him a virgin and not let his duck pound anyone's tom-tom, nothing can be considered funny. CWC is proof that even in a deterministic Universe some people should be laughed at.

Hey

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whatup?
infj
just arriving at the station
avatar to come ;-)

Jess

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Hey just very interested in this topic.

16types and Totalitarianism

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Everything in our official site statistics show most site visitors are guests, yet a publicly-viewable thread on the welfare state gets thrown down the memory hole. How can our guest readers trust us after that? The implications are much deeper. People like @Subteigh, @Socionics Is Not A Cult, and I say "the16types.info is not a cult" joking it is a cult. However, the joke is only funny because it's not entirely true. I believe the16types.info, or as it should now be called, the16types¬info (not-info rather than dot-info, because now there's no info on 16t), is better as an example of totalitarianism. @Singu, for all the pointlessness of debating and always bringing up Popper, at least is right in being viscerally alarmed by what he sees. Let's look at Hannah Arendt's words on the subject:











While I believe giving people types is great, reducing people to types makes them unnecessary as people since they're just types and not even exemplars of types since they get "battle-typed." Likewise, most people here don't even care if socionics is true, which would be fine if they'd not also take it so seriously, or work on proving it if they did. I don't think anyone here believes much anything either. Of course, the whole deleting posts thing is a red flag. Additionally, not using other sites is totalizing by definition. Not even Facebook bans you from using Twitter.

So, do you believe the16types.info is an example of totalitarianism? Why or why not?

Type Me HotelAMBush Questionairre

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The Extended Questionnaire v3.0


What do you study or do for a living?
I am a Customer Services Advisor for the local council.


How did you come to do that? What do you like or dislike about it?
I worked in retail, as a Saturday girl for local woollen shop while doing college level Business Administration (I was always quite good at computers and typing when at school and liked the idea of being helpful, an assistant of sorts). I worked a few retail jobs for more hours after leaving college and did one admin based reception job. My current role I felt was best at pairing my experience of customer service with the admin technical training I had received. I like that I can help people to find the information they need or refer their queries on to people who can. I do find working with the public very tiring though and can be stressful when some customers are very angry, upset, defiant. Busy days with customers tend to leave me mentally frazzled.




What else do you do on a daily basis?
My job is 9-5 and I am very tired after work so tend to go home and watch tv, read, browse on my phone (Pinterest and tumblr). I do have weekends off thankfully and either go out to town with my Mum and autistic brother, meet with friends in the city, or attend the theatre, shopping centres, cinemas, historical landmarks and sites. I thoroughly enjoy travelling to new cities and countries to relish the culture, new opportunities mixed with deep seated history.


What are your interests and hobbies? I have always been interested in music and drama but didn’t believe they were pastimes I could do well. However I have now joined a local opera group and will be singing as a choir member in the Sister Act Musical. I enjoy watching musicals and plays as well as films (although I do find the big LCD screens at cinemas nauseating so tend to wait until DVDs come out). I love learning about history and the natural world (animals, geography). I like random trivia about places and people. Reading is another hobby of mine; I prefer fantasy fiction or factual guide books about places I’ve been to or want to visit.
Why do you do them?
To inspire my imagination, to learn more about peoples inherent nature, and ultimately myself. To give myself a joyful respite from the stresses of reality.


What are your values, and why?
Mercy - an eye for an eye leaves the world blind, plus I’m not a vengeful person at all. I think you should always be kinder than you need to because you don’t know someone’s personal circumstances and headspace fully.
Loyalty/fidelity - I treasure my relationships with close family and the idea of betraying them makes me feel so repulsed, or even giving a stranger a promise and then breaking it gives me so much guilt. I imagine what it would be like to be in their shoes and imagine the vulnerable hurt of a child inside of them if I was disloyal...so would never.
Growth/learning - every day is a school day. No one knows everything but each day you should strive to be a more enlightened person than yesterday.
Respect - give everyone compassion, honour their uniqueness. It’s how I’d like to be treated so treat others in this way.


Describe your relationships with family and friends. What do you like and dislike about them?
With my close family (parents and two brothers) I am very...well...close to them! I feel that I can talk to them about most things but do hold back my emotions when I am upset because I don’t want to hurt them too. I tend to be a bit motherly towards my brothers despite being the middle child; I worry about them and my parents greatly even though they are capable of looking after theirselves. I’m perhaps a bit co-dependent due to my social anxiety. I still live at home and I do rely on my family as being my support network. I don’t have any best friend though get on well with colleagues and old high school friends. It’s more surface level politeness and well wishing. I had one best friend who I do speak to now but we’re more distant; she’s quite rude to me on a few occasions and when I have tried sharing concerns she has ignored me until I was back to “happy normal”. Since then I’ve been wary around her.


What do you look for in friends? In romantic relationships? People who accept me for me, who treat me with respect and understanding, who reach out to me as much as I reach out to them, who are loyal and let me spend time by myself rather than make me feel bad for needing time alone to recharge and reflect. This applies to both friends and romantic relationships. I’m not sure specifically what I’m looking for in a romantic partner. I guess someone supportive, affectionate but not too clingy or dramatic. Someone who’s patient with my shyness at intimacy both physical and mental.


What conflicts have you encountered recently with other people?
Why did they happen? Which kinds seem to happen on a regular basis?
I tend to “clash” mildly with some customers at work who approach my desk when I’m not free. I feel rushed by them and tend to put my guard up, feeling negative towards them when I know rationally I shouldn’t be so annoyed. This happens often that I feel henpecked and pressured by others include colleagues at work. With my close family members we don’t really conflict much, but I tend to fall out with my Mum the most, usually because she’s intruding in my space when I’m needing alone time. She bottles up her emotions as do I so sometimes we can get into heated tearful arguments but tend to make up within the hour.


What are your strengths? What do people like about you? What do you like about yourself? I think people like that I’m patient and flexible towards them, working around their needs and expectations. I’m helpful too and un-imposing. I get called sweet and lovely a lot. My family also say they find me brave, independent and funny too, spirited and smart. I like that I am a problem solver type person; I want to solve and grow from any bumps in the road that come up. Also I like how imaginative I am and that I’m good and writing (although my spelling ability is a bit hit and miss).


What are your weaknesses? What criticism do you often face from others? What do you dislike about yourself? I am not forthcoming, I can be overly obsessive how I “perform” in social and work situations and tend to harbour a lot of guilt; a perfectionist. I rarely stand up for myself or say no so I do appear like a doormat. I don’t like how low my esteem is and how high my anxiety is.


In what areas of life can you manage well on your own?
I can manage travels plans well (getting from A to B), budgeting finances, my mental health (though sometimes need additional support), my pursuit of interests/hobbies, intrapersonal and interpersonal skills.


In what areas of your life would you like help? Advice on if something is worth the price quoted or not (is £500 for a first class plane ticket right or am I being ripped off??), fashion (does this suit me or not?), organising my area (decluttering clutter, best way to work effectively minimising energy usage and maximising results), how to be confident in interpersonal relationships and say “no”.


What things do you dislike doing?
Fast paced exercise - I find it boring and tiring, not to mention I don’t like sweating, but I am trying yoga and gentle walking as an alternative.
Having to go out to a loud party/club. Listening to gossiping and dramatic people - I avoid them. Personal grooming (painting nails, makeup, eyebrow plucking) - I enjoy having these things done to me but if I have to DIY I end up making a mess and I’m upset at the result and/or in pain.


What things do you enjoy more than others? Walking around museums/exhibits. My own company, especially travelling alone (so relaxing!!) dream journaling and psychoanalysing other peoples dreams and behaviours in daily life. Fantasy fiction. Currently I have a big obsession with Baby Yoda :0


What goals, aspirations, or plans do you have for the future, and why?
I would like to have my own place, that’s the first logical step. Then I’d love to find a loving relationship. I’m a bit self conscious but I like to believe it’s possible. And, either get fur babies, adopt, or have our own. I do want to travel more and keep expanding my knowledge of the world and myself. All I want is a happy comforting family life and spiritually moving adventures.


If you won the lottery and didn't have to work anymore, what would you do?
Travel the world and treat my parents to a lovely house of their choice - we live in a Council house and it’s ok but it’s not really ideal.


What traits do you find endearing that others might dislike?
I like people who have a lot of knowledge and are confident in sharing it (Hermione Grainger “know it all” types).
What traits are considered positive/neutral by others but tend to annoy you?
People who do stuff for shock value and attention.


What kinds of things do you do to manage and/or beautify your environment (your room, your house, etc.)? I add trinkets to my room along the theme of fairies, Alice in Wonderland, Disney, mermaids. I use Disney flasks and bottles at work to add my own personal flavour. I like air fresheners (plum, vanilla, linen) since they relax me.


In what situations or times in your life did you feel most fulfilled, and why?
I felt most fulfilled when I was travelling alone in Rome earlier this year. First time solo travelling and Rome was somewhere I always wanted to go; for the history and eclectic art. I went and was entirely comfortable in my own company and relished seeing amazing world wonder sites for the first time.


How do you behave around strangers? Quiet, not self disclosing. However I am very polite and offer help. I feel more at ease around strangers if I can do something for them.


How do you react to conflict? What do you do if somebody insults or attacks you? I avoid the person, or become very tearful if I am backed in a corner and can’t avoid the person/issue. I am stressed and dwell on the conflict for a long time. Sometimes I perceive there’s a conflict when actually the other person advises me later on that there was no conflict in their eyes.


Ever feel stuck in a rut? If yes, describe the causes and your reaction to it. Yes, when my mental health is not so great and my mind is overthinking social situations and perceive faults of me (personality and body image based). I tend to retreat into myself entirely until I’m able to feel better; I play mindful meditations and read self help articles to help change my frame of mind.


Would you ever be interested in starting a business? Why or why not? What role would you play in it? What kind of business would it be? No. I’m not sure I’d feel comfortable charging people money for a service/product. Besides, I’m not really sure what product/service I’d offer that people would want to pay for.


How do you dress or manage your appearance? I am not confident in my appearance and don’t know what styles and colours suit me. I feel physically inferior and divorced from my body but I am working on my dysmorphia issues. I tend to dress for comfort with a feminine touch (jewellery, hair clips). I think I sometimes dress for evening occasions a bit prudish (long sleeves, high neck, long skirt) and I’m shy for showing my body. But again, I’m working on adapting this habit.


What were you like as a child? How have you changed since then? I was quiet around strangers but more talkative around my close family. I could be playful, feisty and cheeky. Now I can be playful sometimes but I’m more serious overall and more subdued than feisty. But I think I still have some sort of inner grit and whimsicalness.


Do you like kids? Why or why not? Yes. Babies are adorable! Though kids of any age are so interesting, pure in heart and spirit, amusing though also more insightful than we give them credit for.


If you are doing a video you can stop here and/or choose from the rest of the questions as you like.


How do you feel about attention? Do you seek it out?


How do you approach responsibility? What do you tend to expect of others?


If you were to raise a child, what would be your main concerns, what approach would you take, and why?


What is your biggest accomplishment?


What was (or is) your high school experience like?


What is something you regret?


Who do you admire, and why?


What's been on your mind? Has anything been worrying or concerning you? What problems have you encountered lately?


What are your spiritual or religious beliefs and why do you hold them?


What are your political beliefs, and why? To what extent do you care about politics?


What kind of work environment do you prefer? What do you look for in a job?


What is or was your favorite school subject and why?


What is one common misconception that people have about life? Explain why it is wrong.


Where did you go on your most recent vacation? What did you do there? How did you like it and why?


Talk about a significant event from your life.


How do you see other people as a whole? What do you consider a prevalent social problem? Name one.


What do you do if you're not getting what you want? What approach do you use?


Are you comfortable taking leadership roles? In what areas? Why or why not?


How often do you get angry? What kinds of things make you angry?


What is one unusual trait or ability you possess? What makes you special?


What is your sense of humor like? Do you joke around a lot?


Your friend bursts into tears. What do you do? How does it make you feel?


What is the best thing that happened to you during the past week?


What is the worst thing that happened to you during the past week?


What is the purpose of life? What do you find personally meaningful in life?


What is the most interesting place you have been, and why?


Do you like surprises?

Avatar Creation Thread

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Who wants a custom avatar? I'll make some for you if you specify what you want or draw a sketch. I think @Grendel @woofwoofl @Nunki might be willing to make some eventually too out of all the people who are online nowadays.

on changing types! & many other questions

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Is it possible? If so, much effort would one have to put towards it to consciously achieve such a feat, or would it have to be a natural process? Would the process require some dramatic traumatic event, or a gradual shift in mindset caused by surrounding influences? If type can't change, what about subtypes? Can a person be influenced by their environment to a degree where they completely mask their original personality, Socionics or real world-wise? Would such a person feel constantly unsatisfied like some part of their identity is missing? Or would they become used to the change from their original identity? Even if you think a person couldn't become, say, their conflictor in a million lifetimes, what about becoming something relatively close, like a mirror or quasi-identical? How would this apply to people with naturally chameleon like personalities?

Since Socionics isn't exactly a hard science, I don't really see any right answers to these questions, but it's always been one of the things I constantly wonder about in my free time; along with how much nature vs nurture plays into determining type. What are your opinions?
p.s.- cute link sprite!! :linkrunning::blow:

Member Questionnaire (Eskrim)

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Member Questionnaire 1 (Eskrim)
What is beauty? What is love?
Something with particular order that has its own meaning. The more you connect to the meaning the stronger the beauty. Love to me is a promise.
What are your most important values?
Peace. The ability to not think things as I try to enjoy life. Contribution to society, I always feel like i have something to prove and also make things right. I always look for something wrong.
Do you have any sort of spiritual/religious beliefs, and why do you hold (or don't) those beliefs in the first place?
There must be something up or out there but I don't know what.
Opinion on war and militaries? What is power to you?
War is inevitable but the extent that we have now I believe should be reducible.
What have you had long conversations about? What are your interests? Why?
I've had shallow but long conversations about how consciousness works and the meaning of life with a friend. I'm interested in how the mind works. I just like to have things in order. It gives me a sense of relief. Simultaneously, I like to once in a while bring chaos into my life. In the end, the result of that chaos is reflected upon to see how it can fit into a routine or daily habit.
Interested in health/medicine as a conversation topic? Are you focused on your body?
I'm sensitive to discomforts but I find it hard to do anything about it.
What do you think of daily chores?
Ugh
Books or films you liked? Recently read/watched or otherwise. Examples welcome.
Movie: Most Christopher Nolan movies, actually. I may have watched Inception more than 40+ times.
Books: I can't read the first page of any novel without getting bored, so I don't ever do it for fun. Maybe it has something to do with being scared of misinterpreting one single sentence and therefore misunderstanding the rest of the story after having read so much. I do, however, like to read science books or self help books if I ever get a hold of it.
What has made you cry? What has made you smile? Why?
An old movie I watched as a kid which was probably The Wizard of Oz. It made me feel a sense of isolation. Yeah, during intense sense of isolation I cry. I smile when I understand things (because I'm always confused and I appreciate these moments when I'm not). I also smile when I can finally sleep, because I always sacrifice sleep for more information I can find to get me to understand whatever it is I don't and want to know.
Where do you feel: at one with the environment/a sense of belonging?
I never felt like I belong anywhere, but best answer is with my family.
What have people seen as your weaknesses? What do you dislike about yourself?
I nag quite a lot. I'm sensitive at any aspect. Emotional, rational, and sensational. That may not be true all the time. I don't hate being so, but I feel like I'm getting in too deep in this life of scrutiny and I'm just deliberately evading so far from what I thought life would be just to reach it.
What have people seen as your strengths? What do you like about yourself?
A lot of people see me as pretty knowledgeable about anything on topic. Not always true, but that's my rep. They also say good hand-eye coordination, enough for some applauses but nothing competitively impressive. Persistent, too, which I agree and like most about myself, but only in short bursts of time. In the long run I have commitment issues.
In what areas of your life would you like help?
I need sleep and social life, although I deliberately try to stay away from it.
Ever feel stuck in a rut? If yes, describe the causes and your reaction to it.
Yes, I had no interest in anything and I failed in schools consistently. My life was a lot of chaos I can't handle, and I felt like there was no point left to live. So I had to figure all of what it means to do anything in life, and I found my personal path.
What qualities do you most like and dislike in other people? What types do you get along with?
I hate people who take pleasure in antagonizing itself. I like people who have the capacity to be kind to everyone or anyone and, in conflict, try to negotiate instead of walk away or attack with pride. Not sure if I get along with anyone for long, but I can get along with nice people.
How do you feel about romance/sex? What qualities do you want in a partner?
Ngl, I'm into aesthetics so looks matter. I love an initiative attitude. I don't like to be too controlling with someone but I inevitably do because something has to be initiated somehow.. Other than that Idk, I haven't had many relationships
If you were to raise a child, what would be your main concerns, what measures would you take, and why?
I'm concerned I won't give my child the right attention. I'd learn a lot about how my child would behave, know what it likes, etc.
A friend makes a claim that clashes with your current beliefs. What is your inward and outward reaction?
Awkwardness goes inward, outwardness is a form of thinking how this can fit into the framework of my understanding and then find something I can use to relate to the friend. That, or argue about it by proposing my point of view in the form of a question. In other words, I try to reduce the conflict with the person.
Describe your relationship to society. How do you see people as a whole? What do you consider a prevalent social problem? Name one.
Society can be ignorant but I believe they're good-willed by their own definitions. I think the biggest social problem is a quickly-dismissive attitude.
How do you choose your friends and how do you behave around them?
I just feel these things. I try to be nice to everyone.
How do you behave around strangers?
If they say hi, I'm curious to what they'll say next. Maybe even try to have a conversation.

Outdoors Allie

Good afternoon, from Canada

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I've been reading literature on socionics for the past couple of months. I've been trying not to let it become anything more than a hobby... Haha. Too late! It's already one of my favourite subjects!

I study biological physics, with a keen interest in neuropsychology. Socionics is so neat... I am always blown away when I see the patterns that I've read in text demonstrated in real life. I can't believe that such a sophisticated, thoughtful body of knowledge concerning the human psyche can exist, despite being so contrary to the traditional scientific method. (Not a bad thing at all. I find it refreshing.) It's really an interesting way of describing cognitive habits and behaviours. I always wonder, what kind of colourful spooks must Jung have encountered when he first dreamed of the four dichotomies? I imagine that they looked an awful lot like the little man who sits inside of my brain and tells me not to put my hand on the hot stove.

Thanks for reading. Pleased to meet you all. :biggrin: I'm not too sure of my own type. But I guess I'll just have to read more.

Yours truly,
Azycat

Rick Owens

Yohji Yamamoto

Most blunt and honest type?

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Is there any socionics type that is very prone to being to being blunt and honest and you don't have to second guess their intentions and what you see is what you get from them?

Which socionics type is the most likely to be this way?

Dislike of duals

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Odd question, but has anyone ever known duals to immediately dislike each other? I think I've seen this happen recently, so I'm curious if anyone has experienced anything similar. If not, I'll brush up on my typing skills. シ

Shocking: Duals not immune to divorce

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Just read that Colin Firth (SLI) and his wife are going to divorce. It never entered my mind to check out his wife's type, but today I did, and I came to a shocking conclusion: DUALS DO DIVORCE!

Lil Uzi Vert

the16types.info has been nominated for the 2020 Nobel Prize in Physics

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For disproving the Laws of Thermodynamics.


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Originally Posted by God View Post
This forum is really going downhill.

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Originally Posted by xerxe View Post
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Originally Posted by Cyclops View Post
This forum is really going downhill these days lol

Similar to Europe's dark ages, the remaining members only discuss VI (whether by choice or being forced to), mimicking the barbarians who incorporated some aspects of Roman culture (socionics) but mostly established their own institutions on previously Roman land. These barbarians fight over the carion of what once was a vibrant body-politic.

Old discussions and seminal philosophical questions are ignored, similar to fields left fallow and structures left to rot. Threads are bumped as a form of entertainment by bemused spectators rather than for serious discussion. There is intellectual stagnation everywhere as old libraries are forgotten.

The workshop represents the Eastern Roman Empire, which split off and preserves some tradition. The workshop is also fuller of intellectual discussion (gold), but nothing matching Rome at its height.

Socionix represents the largest of the barbarian tribes making raids (and now succeeding in carving a domain) on imperial soil.

In having removed the old-guard Mkn00, SubT had a similar career to Odoacer. It remains to be seen who will be the next Clovis, and more importantly, the next Charlemagne.

The Alphas represent a nascent monastic movement. It will be up to them to preserve learning in the horrible times ahead.

ps. I mixed a bunch of stuff that happened in different centuries. Philosophy of history is a joke anyhow.

Quote:

Originally Posted by xyz View Post
Forum's really been going downhill lately.

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Originally Posted by xyz View Post
This forum is really going downhill.

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Originally Posted by ArchonAlarion View Post
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Originally Posted by xyz View Post
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Originally Posted by ArchonAlarion View Post
its called the 16types forum. Its horrible generally and not worth it. I compulsively post here, but yeah its really not worth it so I'm basically done after today. Well at least Im gonna try to force myself to not post anything serious.

Good luck with the Ne

Would you say this forum is going downhill?

lol probably not.

that would imply descent from somewhere higher.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ballistic gerbil View Post
this forum is going downhill.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gilly View Post
I really don't see why you care so much. You hardly post on the forum except to bitch about how poorly it is run, and yet you come on here and insist that things should be changed. Why do you even care? You probably just have some unresolved angst welling up in your stressful middle-age (if you are even as old as you claim to be), and for some reason feel the need to discharge it on "shitty kids who refuse to learn anything."

Honestly, why the fuck do you care so much? You barely post here! Go gripe about someone else's forum-running tactics.

Besides, what is even the point of running the forum like you propose? To avoid silly cuss words? To keep in line with your outmoded sensibilities? In case you haven't noticed, the way I am running the forum is essentially how it has been run from the beginning, only I don't hesitate to explain myself, unlike McNew. And how far downhill has this forum gone? What lows of young'un depravity have we sunk to? Maybe far by your standards, but unfortunately for you, most of the people who post here seem to think it's fine, and as long as they are happy, and I am happy, quite frankly, your opinion is worth dick. When this place collapses because of too much cussing and "things in bad taste," you are free to stand on the mounds of our un-posting account corpses and declare how right you were.

Quote:

Originally Posted by glam View Post
lol Sammy, "welcome to the forum"... you seem like a nice enough person but i feel that you should remember that it's only downhill from here. :D

Quote:

Originally Posted by xerxe View Post
This forum is really going downhill.

Quote:

Originally Posted by heath View Post
going downhill is usually pretty fun on a bike, sled, skis, etc.

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Originally Posted by xkj220 View Post
The quality of information is declining overall on the forum. A lot of bias is present. We need more Te valuers who know their stuff right.

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Originally Posted by crazedrat View Post
it's been going downhill for a year now, and we're still falling. so where are we going? fuck, to hell?

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Originally Posted by Gilly View Post
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Originally Posted by Blaze View Post
this forum is really starting to go downhill

This has been said, how many times?

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Originally Posted by Waddlesworth View Post
The 16types.info forums started to go 'downhill' at precisely twelve forty hours EST, June 15th, 2005.

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Originally Posted by Wynch View Post
Quote:

Originally Posted by xyz View Post
This forum's going downhill.




(:-D)

Oh Mah Gawd!

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Originally Posted by xyz View Post
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Originally Posted by Abbie the Child View Post
Quote:

Originally Posted by xyz View Post
This forum's really going downhill.

That's what they said last year when McNew was in charge. :O

You misunderstand, I was simply stating an unassailable fact for newcomers.

Gilly's unstable nature really doesn't take away from it's... uh, downhillyness

Quote:

Originally Posted by 717495 View Post
The forum isn't getting worse, but it certainly is going downhill.

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Originally Posted by Khola View Post
IMO it's going downhill. In the past I have been interested in getting involved in serious discussion on Socionics/serious discussion in general here. McNew was a douche, but he was so fantastical that for the better part, people ignored him and carried on trying to at least have some intelligent interaction.

I like Gilly, but it feels as if there is very little structure in this place now. If I run a search for most recent posts (which is typically how I navigate this forum), most of the thread hits I get will be pointless. Fun, sure, but pointless. A deep rant about how someone was personally affected by something in life that reads more like a speech than an 'in' for discussion, some silly thread that is just attention-grabbing and doesn't even pretend to be about anything in particular, someone complaining about someone else that creates a flame thread which then captures most of the forum's attention, derails and then becomes another pointless joke thread, general banter about favourite music or whatever without much lead-in to intelligent conversation - things have devolved from being threads like this:

This happened in my life: how does this pertain to socionics and what are varying points of view, advice and interest on it?

to this

This happened in my life look at me, I just thought I'd state it without asking for any input look at me!

from this:

What pass times/music/popular social elements connect and resonate with certain types/quadras? Discuss.

to this:

What music are you thinking about I like music hihihihihi

While I do really enjoy the odd joke thread and think that it allows us to see some of the more relaxed aspects of each other, I'm missing the meat in the sandwich when it comes to this place lately.

I'm finding that most threads that I read don't have any opportunity for a response any more highly evolved than a basic yes/no response or some candid "that's what she said" response. It's taking the interest out of it for me because the fun stuff has become the detritus of this forum and the opportunity to learn and discuss with other people has diminished.

I don't think that this is directly Gilly's fault (or anyone else's). Perhaps instead of casting blame, we could all share some suggestions about restructuring this place and perhaps, more importantly, stop and think before we make another thread that leads to nowhere, stop and think before we make another thread bitching about some forum member.....and most importantly, I think we should all make an effort to post one or two serious, interesting threads that allow for better conversation from now on. If you don't like the forum, remember that part of it is your product. Let's stop complaining and start looking at the way we respond and post here and try to fix things from the inside out. Also, perhaps less troll feeding. If someone tries to derail a thread and you get upset about it and begin to complain, they have won. Ignore it and lead out from the previous discussion and the attempted thread derailment will most likely get lost amongst the other more relevant posts.

I know I'm as responsible for such actions as the next person. Anyway, that's how I've felt lately, so I'll offer it up in an attempt to change things. What are everyone else's opinions regarding this? Are there any other suggestions on how to give this place more structure? Do you guys resonate with this?

Ok, I'm taking off my serious cap now. You know it's trouble when the SEI gets up on a soapbox waxing serious business hypotheticals. :P

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Originally Posted by 717495 View Post
The forum going downhill is actually a compliment, because it implies that the forum was or is uphill.

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Originally Posted by Subteigh View Post
It really depends on what sort of timescale...and I couldn't answer Yes or No anyhow because I feel that I am above criticism.

P.S. Anyone who thinks I'm being passive-aggressive can go fuck themselves.

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Originally Posted by Bardia View Post
There will always be people who derail threads and always joke, who come for the social experience, or who cause a lot of drama. That doesn't bother me too much and I don't even really incorporate that in my opinion that the forum has gone downhill. What does count is the fact that I haven't read anything on here in a while that has given me that "aha i learned something new and important." Maybe its because I don't read it all the time when I am away at school. Or maybe not.

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Originally Posted by Joy View Post
People have said "the forum's really going downhill lately" for as long as I've been here. (Coincidence? :lol:)

Seriously though, I think people just like to bitch. There's always someone who's unhappy. Don't worry about it.

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Originally Posted by Subteigh View Post
It is simply the case that even when this forum was going uphill, it was going downhill.

This forum expanded and became increasingly cold and meaningless, and it is my firm belief the forum is now finally engaged in consuming itself.

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Originally Posted by Animal View Post
I'm currently job-hunting and so am spending more time than I'd like plopped in front of my computer so I've had some time to catch up with my 16types reading. This forum has really gone downhill. ;)

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Originally Posted by glam View Post
i just want to say that i don't complain just for the hell of it, and for any little thing. i generally only say something when i feel it's something pretty important that needs to be addressed.

by saying something when we feel that an admin/mod did something that we see as wrong means that we are NOT "sitting on our arses"; most of us are not admins/mods so we cannot take any direct action beyond speaking out about something, or reporting posts and such; "sitting on our arses" would be not saying anything at all when we disagree with an administrative/moderation decision.

and because people find value in the place, they speak up when they disagree with such things like what happened Maritsa. yes, we always joke about this forum perpetually going downhill, but if we didn't care about the forum we wouldn't bother saying anything.

you are right that it's Gilly's forum and he can do whatever he wants, but administration/moderation decisions on this forum have generally always been discussed by everyone, which is a good thing. just because the owner can do what they want doesn't mean we all have to be silent about it, especially when he seemingly gave us an opportunity to speak by creating this thread in the first place. of course in the end Gilly is technically under no obligation to change his decisions, but some of us would like to say something if we have the chance.

i would have absolutely no problem moderating people who deserved it, lol, but i'm not an admin/mod. don't make such assumptions.


the main problems i have with your post is that you are basically calling for everyone to shut up, just because Gilly owns the forum and can do whatever he wants in the end, and because supposedly all of us are "sitting on our arses", which i heavily disagree with.

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Originally Posted by Gilly View Post
Christ, you people whine about how this forum is going downhill/has no serious discussion, and then a thread like this goes untouched. The fuck do you want from me.

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Originally Posted by Brilliand View Post
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Originally Posted by Banana Pancakes View Post
Why I'm here: Just curious to see if anything changed in 4 months - it hasn't.

Ah, so the forum is NOT going downhill! :D:P

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Originally Posted by 717495 View Post
Sort of random, but the humor just clicked kind of off,-psychologically as to why Ashton thinks he shares the same Te/Fi values as Expat, instead of Fe/Ti. I believe it is hilarious, but I can't be sure if that is just my brain thinking that. Oh and by the way

This forum is going downhill.

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Originally Posted by xerxe View Post
You're all jealous because she doesn't type you as her dual. :8*

This forum is seriously going downhill.

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Originally Posted by inumbra View Post
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Originally Posted by Beautiful sky View Post
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Originally Posted by inumbra View Post
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Originally Posted by Beautiful sky View Post
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Originally Posted by inumbra View Post
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Originally Posted by Beautiful sky View Post
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Originally Posted by Ezra View Post
Has the forum finally died?

With only a few threads active every few days, I think it's well on its way to death. Everything about socionics that can be discussed (within reason) has been discussed, in most cases over and over and over again. People have grown bored and left. Others futilely post in boredom.

That is Ni speaking...where is it going?...time not Ne...rather you're projecting the forum's events or progress in the flow of time.

I swear, like every member of the forum has said "the forum's going down hill, it's dying!" at one time or another.

I thought Ezra was being over dramatic and wanted people to post interesting topics so he wouldn't be bored or something.

This thread is doing this:

To understand the difference, let us consider a row of people representing the types ENTj and ENFj, i.e. with introverted intuition as the secondary function. This function entails certain kind of “prophet-like” or “preacher-like” behavior. Such people believe in magnificent perspectives, and they try to transfer their belief to other people, even when the situation is really bad and gloomy. A common trait that united them all – their “prophet-like” behavior, their capability to “infect” people with belief in the future, even when several minutes ago people were much dissatisfied of them.

I don't open threads like this, I'm far too optimistic for this kind of infecting like tone he addresses here.

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Originally Posted by Beautiful sky View Post
YES!!!!!!!!!

Because I truly do see Socionics as the new psychology and once it is popular here, we will all be at the forefront.


This post goes like this:

To understand the difference, let us consider a row of people representing the types ENTj and ENFj, i.e. with introverted intuition as the secondary function. This function entails certain kind of “prophet-like” or “preacher-like” behavior. Such people believe in magnificent perspectives, and they try to transfer their belief to other people, even when the situation is really bad and gloomy. A common trait that united them all – their “prophet-like” behavior, their capability to “infect” people with belief in the future, even when several minutes ago people were much dissatisfied of them.

No my Ne is used in a way to project the sequence of outcome not Preach the current state and the way things are going in an infectuous way. If people get dissatisfied with me it causes depression not further preaching.

Don't prophets do things like:

"let's all rise and go forth" stuff...I'm not saying that I am projecting a sequence of events.

I think these are little details and typing people off of starting a thread and saying the forum's dying is silly along with the whole "Ni is time" so if anyone says anything about how it's gonna go, they must be Ni (that's why I said my first comment). Also, I don't see Ezra as a "prophet" and didn't really think that description described him anyway really.

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Originally Posted by electric sheep View Post
we must now make a facebook group to keep the dream alive.

the16types facebook group?

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Originally Posted by Rubicon View Post
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Originally Posted by Subteigh View Post
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Originally Posted by nobrainer View Post
Nice forum...but... where are the fucking moderators? You wanna keep it clean of fucking spam. What the fuck the admin is thinking about? Hey, you can't just abandon your forum and move to Hawaii with a rockafella chick...Oh no you can't ;)

yeah, this forum is really going downhill

keep calm and carry on, you nutcase :whistle:

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Originally Posted by Abbie the Child View Post
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Originally Posted by Gilly View Post
The forum is dying for real this time.

Negetivist.

If it's been dying so many times, how come it still ain't dead?

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Originally Posted by xerxe View Post
lol. You can't kill this place no matter how hard you try. Even if you did succeed, two more will take its place.

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Originally Posted by Brilliand View Post
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Originally Posted by Abbie the Child View Post
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Originally Posted by Brilliand View Post
This forum is really going downhill.

:O That's what they said last year. How big is this hill?

Actually, that's the forum's new catchphrase. Thanks to saying that on a regular basis, the forum is now going uphill!

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Originally Posted by ilikesex View Post
about a year and a half ago the forum crashed into the bottom of a hill and has stayed there since.

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Originally Posted by Uncle Ave View Post
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Originally Posted by 717495 View Post
So this really was a Socionics forum back in the day?

Yeah, it was in the very, very beginning until a few people like Joy came around and turned it into a popularity cult.

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Originally Posted by ballistic gerbil View Post
we should just give Hugo all of the moderator/admin passwords and shut the place down. Blank out the wikipedia article, tie Rick up and send him back to Russia, then shoot Niffweed in the head and declare Tcaud King of Socionics.

win.

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Originally Posted by Capitalist Pig View Post
Well I always thought this place would be a good cover for a private bitorrent tracker. Maybe swap some porn on the side. We've got enough hot chicks to have our own amateur camwhore section; available only to "premium" members, of course. A $10.00 donation should be sufficient to obtain said premium status.

I, of course, deserve honors just for originating the idea. :biggrin:

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Originally Posted by Brilliand View Post
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Originally Posted by BandD View Post
Okay I know some people have complained the forum is going 'downhill' and dying but I'm in the process of creating the 16 types adventurers 'Web Comic.' Yes folks, the pure gay king fag/gaylord/gay shaman artist who sees through ALL of society's veils (every goddamn single one of them) is back and you're gonna love this. I already rough-drafted the first two issues...I just have to create the comic of it in my paint program.

Basically here's how the comic is going to work. Each issue has 16 pages, which is just enough to tell a nice story without overwhelming people. And each 'season' will have 16 issues/episodes. (get the pattern?) I want to balance plot with character development. Some issues will be 2 and 3 parters as well.

(I still am working on the rpg too, here and there when I have a chance)

I also need webspace for this....if anybody knows of a good free site then tell me. Or I'll just upload them all to photobucket or something...shouldn't run out of space I don't think.

Oh no! Now the forum will stop going downhill, so it will stop going uphill, and...

A comic. That I can appreciate.

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Originally Posted by xerxe View Post
Afaik, the secret of turning iron into gold, and a more accurate value for pi were both lost during the great purge. Since then the forum has really been going downhill.

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Originally Posted by ballistic gerbil View Post
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Originally Posted by Subteigh View Post
Where do you see yourself in a 100 years time?

in the chatbox telling people that this forum is really going downhill.

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Originally Posted by ballistic gerbil View Post
this forum is really going downhill.

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Originally Posted by male View Post
Is this forum really going downhill???

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Originally Posted by Capitalist Pig View Post
Depends on your orientation relative to the center of the Earth.

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Originally Posted by cracka View Post
This forum has always begin on going downhill. Luckily, it seems that it's descending at a such a slow pace that it really doesn't matter much. :o

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Originally Posted by male View Post
IMO the forum isn't going downhill. I personally think it's been improving lately.

This thread was not a serious thread. I just thought I'd do my bit as a meme vector :whistle:

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Originally Posted by Krig the Viking View Post
This forum is like a reverse Sisyphus -- condemned to eternally go downhill, without ever reaching the bottom. ;)

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Originally Posted by male View Post
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Originally Posted by Aiss View Post
I'm not quite sure about the forum, but this thread is.

So what's the point where this thread can no longer go downhill?

And then will it be an uphill struggle after that?

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Originally Posted by ballistic gerbil View Post
so what this thread is saying it that the forum is doing this...




right?

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Originally Posted by ballistic gerbil View Post
poop.

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Originally Posted by ballistic gerbil View Post
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Originally Posted by Pa3s View Post
I fail to understand why someone should want to own the forum, anyway...

some people think that it's more fun to drive downhill than it is to sit in the backseat screaming. :D

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Originally Posted by 717495 View Post
Might have to sell the forum to McDonalds, and they'll make Sociotype happy meal toys.

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Originally Posted by Aiss View Post
lol @ this thread.

Russia isn't Ne/Si. Cold weather and brilliant scientists arguments, indeed. This forum is so going downhill. :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by ballistic gerbil View Post
this forum is really going downhill.

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Originally Posted by Simon Ssmall View Post
It's no longer a dating site, so why aren't you joining now?


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Originally Posted by female View Post
Obligatory the forum is going downhill post.

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Originally Posted by 717495 View Post
The forum is starting to go downhill.

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Originally Posted by Abbie the Child View Post
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Originally Posted by Ashton View Post
Socionics is dead, along with any mandate for this board to exist other than as a social venue for surviving remnants of the community. But eventually we'll all stop logging in here because it will too boring to bother.

:reallymad: Socionics is not dead. The forum always goes downhill. It never dies. It is a perpetual motion mechanism.

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Originally Posted by Hitta View Post
The forum is twice as dead now than when Maritsa was here.... now what?

I told you this was gonna happen; there is a flaw in the forum's setup.

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Originally Posted by Simon Ssmall View Post
You mean Maritsa is not posting anymore and the post amount have shrunk? Impossible...

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Originally Posted by cracka View Post
The forum always goes downhill, though it will keep going and going and going... no matter the changes that it goes through, this place will have traffic.

It's a hang out spot for people, online. That's it. Sure, some can say they come here for discussion about socionics, but in the grand scheme of things, this is a place for people to sit around with a common theme among the discussion.

I've been a member since May 2006 and it's still not really any different now than it was in the past. The discussion changes and the people have changed, but the forum is really not much different. The only difference I see is what some have called quadra shifts among the kinds of discussion and the way that discussion is handled.

I think all the quadras have had a hold on this place over the years. The one thing this does, it makes people post more or less, and in some cases leave or come back... generally speaking of course. When I got here, there were about 40 active posters on this forum, of those 40, maybe 10 are actually still active. With new people come different people of different types...

Back in 2006, most of the active posters were in high school or college, and now most of those folks are gone. This may come as a shock to some, but it seems like people actually grow out of coming here, or life kinda gets in the way...lol. I'm not saying that everyone does, but it's a common enough occurence to mention.

Personally, I don't see you, Hitta, as ever being here without bitching about something. I don't really mean this in a bad way, but I don't see you ever being happy with this place. I'm sure if you had some actual control over it, that may change, but until you could have things exactly how you want them, you'll never be happy with it.

Edited to add: Unless this place became very stringent on the rules regarding socionics where it would be talked about as seriously as you actually would want... I think that would cause more people to leave than stay though.

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Originally Posted by Aiss View Post
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Originally Posted by ballistic gerbil View Post
I quit too.
the cake was a lie.

... this forum is going downhill.

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Originally Posted by The Joker View Post
People choose to be blind to the truth. Reality crosses their mind and they make themselves forget it. Choosing to believe what feels most comfortable instead. This is why this forum is heading downhill because people refuse to see what's right in front of them. That this forum is diseased with viruses that are slowly eating it up. However, it wouldn't matter so much if the forum was healthy, but it's merely a shell of its former self.

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Originally Posted by krieger View Post
would those of you who think the forum is continually going downhill please look at the first page in this thread and snap to your senses.

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Originally Posted by Gilly View Post
This forum is going downhill.

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Originally Posted by EyeSeeCold View Post
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Originally Posted by Lotus View Post
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Originally Posted by Taknamay View Post
All of us are awesome. Together.

We make a great team, guys and gals! O:

wrong. this forum is actuallY super lame and boring. i can see tumbleweeds on the horizon

Apparently the16types.info has been going downhill for several years. This reminds me of the never-ending staircase Director Abbie once posted.



This place needs reform and has been needing it for the longest. According to historical trend, the16types is due for new administration. Hkkmr has been doing a not-bad job but it's not really effective and impacting, and so the forum is the same as it ever was. And this is mostly because of a few perpetually unsolved problems. The problem with the staff1 is that they don't act like staff and are poor exemplars for the community. Either they were chosen out of favoritism and are poorly fit for administration, they are inactive and/or shirk their positions as administration, or don't contribute anything worthwhile to Socionics. Another problem is the lack of policy, every new surge of activity just gets insulated and dies out due to insufficient management of human resources, along with forum member conduct going unregulated and un-addressed which is detrimental to the development of the Socionics community in the Western hemisphere.

There could only be three reasons why this forum never changes. One - the type of people Socionics attracts; two - Socionics fails as a topic; and three - stale members haven't been naturally pruned for a fresh generation. Two of those can't be helped but the last can, through recruitment and advertising, and a community overhaul. And until any of this is attended to, this forum will always be going downhill.


That said, I'm willing to take over as owner / head administrator, for a fee.

[1] - Staff as a whole. Not all staff members fall within the criticism.

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Originally Posted by Abbie the Child View Post
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Originally Posted by EyeSeeCold View Post
This reminds me of the never-ending staircase Director Abbie once posted.

I think it's a positive thing. We cannot die! :muaha:

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Originally Posted by Taknamay View Post
You know, I think there is a way this is possible. The staircase could just happen to be slanted like this, but overall be horizontal.

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Originally Posted by Pa3s View Post
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Originally Posted by Abbie the Child View Post
That would mean we have to go uphill sometimes.

Exactly, the forum is more like this.

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Originally Posted by Taknamay View Post
Well, I just meant geometrically possible >.<

You wouldn't actually keep falling... unless there were some complex thing going on.

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Originally Posted by Capitalist Pig View Post

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Originally Posted by female View Post
Why do you think the forum is going downhill?
I've been wondering about this for a while and can't come up with any concrete answer. I remember when people used to say this a lot. "The forum is going downhill". And I feel that some sort of change usually came on the heels of that statement. But there was a point, somewhat recently, the timing of which I'm not sure of, that the forum somehow became a lot more empty feeling. I don't know if this is a personal perception or if it has a more objective basis (I'm definitely not as involved here as I used to be). But I remember when this place was so full of life that you didn't have to so much dip your toe in the water to get some vivid response. Now it feels like a tumbleweed blows through here and no one even twitches in reaction, lol. One thought that crossed my mind was that the community no longer feels as tight knit and personal as it used to. There are a lot of forum old timers that I miss, that no longer post regularly, and perhaps the forum doesn't feel truly alive to me without them. I like the new people and the fresh faces, but I just don't have the history with them. Do you have any ideas, theories, or reasons for the current state of the forum?

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Originally Posted by 1981slater View Post
Is the forum going downhill? Drink 2 or 3 pints of beer and ask yourself the same question. The answers will probably have improved from "Yes" to "Nope, everything seems so cooooool noowwwww". If you keep drinking beyond that point, the most probable answer will be "Who cares?". Finally, if you make it till the super drunk state, the answer will be "Argghhj gr gr gr".

Seriously speaking, the forum has stagnated. We have typed ourselves, some users have retyped us, we have typed celebrities. There has been no agreements on lots of typings and we have reached a stalemate. Only the fall of one of the two antagonistic blocs (people who know about Socionics v people who can't type correctly) will enable us to achieve a Pax Socionika, in which the widely accepted typings of Madonna as SLE, Bill Gates as ILE and Mickey Mouse as LSE will set the framework for development of Socionics.

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Originally Posted by Nanners View Post
You consider this going downhill? This forum gets more posts than I can keep up with, at least a few of those posts are actually interesting, it has a very diverse member list, and the new host is faster than I can click.

How can that be considered going downhill?

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Originally Posted by NewBorn STAR View Post
I am still asking without questions.

uphill is the new downhill. stfu whore and ejoy the death

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Originally Posted by Abbie the Child View Post
It WAS always going downhill but never reaching bottom. That was part of its identity. What did you do, hkkmr?! :o

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Originally Posted by 1981slater View Post
Apparently at least, the forum is going downhill. However, those who live in the Southern Hemisphere may not agree with us: they see the forum going uphill. Once the forum reaches Australia, it will start to go downhill from their point of view, so we will see it advancing uphill again 

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Originally Posted by Park View Post
Because it's 2012 and the world is going to end soon. Duh!

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Originally Posted by Capitalist Pig View Post
i wish this forum was pink

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Originally Posted by ballistic gerbil View Post
idk if it's me or the forum, but i just don't feel like posting about myself on here anymore. if i want to talk to people, i go into tinychat. blah... even this thread, i just don't have anything to say. for some reason i still come here and reload throughout the day though, hoping that something interesting will happen again. i guess i just don't feel the sense of community anymore, or if it's here, i feel like i've put myself on the sidelines to the point that the only way that i'm a part of it is as a memory of what i once was here.

sorry dolphin, i didn't really post any reasons why i think the forum is going downhill lately, but i've felt the same thing for a few months now. it's like the forum has become a field of zombies aimlessly wandering around bumping into eachother muttering "brains?" halfheartedly, knowing that any brains found will be old, stale, and already picked over.

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Originally Posted by Galen View Post
This forum is a veritable Sisyphus of downhill-dom. Or I guess uphill-dom? You can mentally change the story of Sisyphus to fit with this situation however you want.

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Originally Posted by jessica129 View Post
Dolphin, you're so good with words. When I read anything you write it's like sweet angels signing. I'm serious. You could make a nutritional guide sound interesting.

Anyway, I'm sort of with you on the forum dying. I kind of don't really know many of the people that post here now...the only subforums I visit are Anything Else and occasionally I'll look at the Famous Persons section but I feel like everything about Socionics has already been said. I stay out of the Quadra section because i'm still not goddamn sure what type i am and Anything Else is just too slow for my attention span. It was kind of a fun place when people used the Chatbox but it's like no one ever goes there anymore...they don't even go to stickam anymore. The tragedy.

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Originally Posted by ArchonAlarion View Post
This forum is going downhill because of the following reasons:

1. Decrease in population of older members who post consistently in a mature and authoritative way

2. Influx of young, casual members who last for maybe half a year and barely understand or care to research the theory

3. A forum dynamic that has developed over the years in which people disparage the theory despite an active interest in it.

4. A forum dynamic common to many forums in which there is a small active group of old-timers that have a common-experience, not shared by newer members. The older members continually refer to this common-experience despite it's irrelevance.

5. A lack centralized theoretical conflict (half the forum members believe this, half that), and instead, decentralized, personal ramblings.

6. Lack of external, informational sites (such as Rick's blog) closely connected to the forum.


These are some of the primary reasons why the forum has been "dying." Some are inevitable and some preventable.

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Originally Posted by mu4 View Post
I think it's downhill/uphill is cyclical and also highly influenced by life outside of the forum. Many members here came when they were in a exploratory period of their life and attempting to find something to study/explain their life situation. As time goes on, they move away from this exploratory period of their life and engage socially in order to acquire some material advancement, whether it be in education, relationship and/or employment, etc. This all takes away from people's participation in the forum as well as active dialog. If you observe the life changes the older members have gone through and are going through, it's easy to see people that have slowly become inactive have made advancements in various areas of life outside of the forum, many which make interacting here a secondary priority.

Consequently while all this is happening, new members join and the forum changes due to the influx of new voices and opinions. When older members return, they find this change disconcerting and distance is created between the member and the forum.

BTW Reuben was literally 20% of the activity of this forum during the period he was active. :biggrin:

Let me put in my opinion here too, I personally think activity is not the most important thing for this forum, nor is drama. To me the most important thing for this community is the physical, mental, psychological health of it's members. The forum is not some sort of addictive escapism for your troubles or drama central for spectators, although this is generally going to be around. I would much rather have more members on this forum that spend less of their time but are able to find something of value, then a few members who spend all of their time here and likely waste it.

There was a period of time when this forum did not get many new members, recently many new members have been joining and integrating into this community. You might think they're new and fresh, but in time, they will be viewed as old timers as well.

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Originally Posted by somavision View Post
I was never really someone who posted alot, but I did spend alot of time reading the posts and I certainly got more involved than I do now... not always for the better. I hav e found this place less interesting than I used to, I would attribute that to finding new things to learn about and the gradual fading of the novelty that this theory once held for me.

Despite this, there are a lot of people who post here who I find interesting. Just perhaps not enough, to really try to get more involved ...


When I joined here, the old school members complained of how the forum was going downhill, how it had fallen from those brave new days in 2005, I was new then, I had nothing to gauge it against and I thought that the forum was ahive of activity, nonsense, knowledge and original thought.

Perhaps things are worse now, perhaps the crackpots, the visionaries and the researchers have either run out of steam, or reached that pot where they are being tolerated and ignored. Saying this I don't read everything on the forum so I may be wrong, but I've certainly become habituated to Maritsa et al, and I've not read anything in a while that has provoked me in any sense.

I really don't know, I see plenty of new members posting, and that people come and go is a characteristic of any forum. Objectively I have seen no real evidence of a long term downhill trend. For me though, perhaps.

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Originally Posted by Blaze View Post
The law of entropy applies.

Where is the left and what innovations have been tried?

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Originally Posted by ashlesha View Post
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Originally Posted by somavision View Post
It has just occured to me that perhaps the recently new feature of being able to mark a post "like" or "constructive", may in part responsible fro at least some of the decrease.

For example, before this function, I would have had to have written a post to state that I found that I found the information you provided "constructive", I would have invariably included more information than just the word "constructive" and this may have opened up the door for something else.

i marked this post constructive and then i scrolled up without responding and realized the irony lol. i think i would be more active without the button because i feel trivial just quoting a post for a +1 or something so i feel compelled to say more, which other people might respond to, etc etc. i really like being able to give a nod to what someone said without jumping in but i do think it makes me lazy and i'd be better off without that feature.

im somewhat new compared to most of the people talking about the forum going downhill but from what i understand there used to be like this battle of expat and niffweed vs socionix or whatever and everybody was into it. and now expat and niffweed are mostly gone and its kind of like socionix "won" lol. and it makes me think of how in stories theres the buildup and conflict and resolution and then it has to end. it makes me wonder what the forum was like prior to all of that stuff. i suppose there were a lot more people who were new and still exploring then but i dont know.

also in older posts ive seen its more assumed that everything is type related lol. and i basically think nothing is type related and its more sophisticated to take individual differences in nuances into account but i think the forum would be more fun without that sophistication. "ntr" puts an end to so many conversations.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taknamy View Post
Has anyone mentioned gravity? I think that's why most things go downhill

Quote:

Originally Posted by pokeball View Post
Our children will be posting here some day. That makes Joy a true trailblazer.

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Originally Posted by Capitalist Pig View Post
Quote:

Originally Posted by Jimbean View Post
The forum is a reflections of us. If we are going downhill, than the forum will also go downhill.

Ahh, Jimbean, long time no see. You've come out of retirement to enlighten us with your Zen-like wisdom once more. Welcome, welcome!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Radio View Post
it's a bit like a barber's pole, endlessly descending but not really getting any lower.

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Originally Posted by Pa3s View Post
Forum's going downhill, amirite?

Quote:

Originally Posted by tcaudilllg View Post
The16types is critically ill
Less than 70 people have visited in the last 24 hours. It's not Memorial Day anymore.

Marie84 says she's quitting not because of disinterest in socionics, but because the discussion has reached a low.

If something doesn't change, the socionics community will collapse back into the MBTI community.

A number of the regulars here don't even take socionics seriously. Why do they keep posting? Why are they allowed to?

What has it come to that the rhetoric of a guy who attacks the foundation on which socionics is built is the talk of the day?

Quote:

Originally Posted by tcaudilllg View Post
Literally half the forum has up and left. The community is dissipated.

Does anyone have a backup copy held over from the Gilly era? Because it's clear that hkkmr intends to destroy the forum.

Eh I guess I'd better plan for a post-socionics era. Because it looks like people are throwing their hands up at it. Maybe this is an opportunity for a more serious community with a new approach.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tcaudilllg View Post
It's not who left, but why. There are serious problems that are not being addressed, and it is causing attrition. End of the Roman Empire effect.

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Originally Posted by golden View Post
T
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f
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Originally Posted by Ozz View Post
It does feel the forum is sliding downhill, but I seem to recall a similar conversation while (a year?) ago. Does any one have any stats

Quote:

Originally Posted by ballistic gerbil View Post
Are thread titles of the form "is X the way of the future?" the way of the future?
To lessen productivity, gain cheap 'likes', and to troll forum member "tcaud", some members are creating threads where the thread title is of the form "Is X the way of the future?" and bloating the Philosphy, Politics, Economics subforum with garbage threads. A big concern is members suffering mental anguish as the joke becomes ever more watered down with meta-ness and the lols threaten to fall off a plateau. Could this trend be indicative of the eternal downhill direction of the16types.info forum?

Quote:

Originally Posted by tcaudilllg View Post
Good news: the forum is no longer in decline
It has now reached rock bottom. From here, there is nowhere to go but up.
Let's hear it for Melkor, Lord of Arda!

Quote:

Originally Posted by glam View Post
that bad huh? perhaps we'll need to align with the MBTI folks and form the Last Alliance of MBTI & Socionics. on the way to the battlefield, the Enneagramers can join us for the final fight.

Socially Awkward Peoples of Typology, unite!

Quote:

Originally Posted by krieger View Post
if the forum was visibly declining i'd experience that as a good thing because at least there would be a perception of change. the reality is worse. this place just stagnates. it sits there doing nothing. it doesn't go through phases or have its ups and downs, it just like like *this* all the time. and meanwhile all the time spent here is practically wasted.

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Originally Posted by Raver View Post
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Originally Posted by Ath View Post
Quote:

Originally Posted by Raver View Post
The forum's IQ has been on a downhill trajectory lately. :?

People are always saying this forum is going downhill in some way. They were saying it years back, in fact.

The forum isn't going downhill, I meant the IQ of it considering the recent surge of "Does it matter" threads, but it's just a short phase that will pass so I'm not really worried. 

Quote:

Originally Posted by ashlesha View Post
i'm kinda let down, i made this thread because there was some interesting conversation in chat and i thought some arguments of equal caliber could be made in a thread to be looked at all in one place but it seems like nobody wants to bother. forum is going downhill and all that. not that i really blame anyone.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joy View Post
Quote:

Originally Posted by ashlesha View Post
forum is going downhill and all that.

People always say this. The more things change, the more they stay the same.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coffee HD View Post
You are all a bunch of...

.. you thought I'm going to say something negative? I didn't.

But you thought so, because you know you all suck and there is a lot of negative about you, and should have done better in life than jerking off to this socionics theory, thinking it will get you laid or make you understand people.

To understand people you have to go out and interact with them. But you are all too stuck in life to do that. Bully victims, peniless losers, housewifes in bad relationships and mommas boys. This forum has really gown downhill.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Capitalist Pig View Post
this forum has been going downhill since <arbitrary moment in history>

Quote:

Originally Posted by Capitalist Pig View Post
successful troll thread is successful

Quote:

Originally Posted by Capitalist Pig View Post
This forum is in trouble, but don't worry because I have a plan to rejuvenate it and restore whatever qualities it has lost. This will work because I have very strong opinions about how the forum should be run, but I have never actually run a forum, much less know what it takes to maintain even a moderately successful website. I have no practical experience that would give me any kind of insight on this topic, but you should listen to me because of my reg date or some other arbitrary reason that allows me to make a specious claim of authority. I have been around, and I can see the writing on the wall. This forum is going downhill, I guarantee you, unless the administration listens to me because I am smart despite my complete lack of experience or qualifications. Please don't ask me to prove how I know this forum is in trouble, I just KNOW it is. Don't bother me with facts about how new member registration is steady and that the number of active users is moreorless stable and not in any sort of significant decline. My emotional appeal and how I relate my subjective experience of the forum should be enough for you to agree with me. Mark my words, this place is going down the tubes, and it's all because no one will listen to me!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beautiful sky View Post
How many times have people said this in the past....

I don't agree because the number of people in the world is not decreasing and secondly as long as it's here people will find it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by InvisibleJim View Post
The number of the people in the world is increasing.

Therefore the number of people participating in the16types.info is increasing.

That's socionics.

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Originally Posted by Kim View Post
Just fire these goddamn incompetent moderators already.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Airman View Post
The fact that this thread is the 'hotttest' thread clearly entails this forum is going downhill once again.

Quote:

Originally Posted by InvisibleJim View Post
The sky is falling.

We're all doomed!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Capitalist Pig View Post
This forum is going downhill
Discuss. :popcorn:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Subteigh View Post
I yearn for the halcyon days of Hugo, Waddlesworth, Jimbean, Rocky, science as magic, Cone, Transigent, Typhon, CuriousSoul, LucasWinfield and co.

Quote:

Originally Posted by xerxe View Post
This forum's been going downhill for 10 years.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kopyk View Post
this topic is shit :thumbsdown:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Subteigh View Post
As quantity is clearly more important than quality, I can PROVE that the forum has been going downhill since April-May 2008 in terms of average number of posts per day...

(:p actually, it's quite possible of course that the record for most posts in a day happened at any other time. There was an average of 670.7 posts per day between 12 April 2008 17:27 UTC and 12 May 2008 17:43 UTC)

As for threads, we've being going downhill for longer, since September-October 2007...between the 12th September 2007 17:48 UTC and 12th October 2007 17:48 UTC there was an average of 33.3 threads a day.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Capitalist Pig View Post
well at least now the bi-annual "forum is going downhill" thread has some data to back it up

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Originally Posted by Aylen View Post
Quote:

Originally Posted by Holon View Post
Quote:

Originally Posted by Kalinoche the Child View Post
HI U ARRIVED DURING THE FORUM'S FINEST TIMES

Would you say that... this forum is really going downhill?

An optimist might say it is really going uphill, maybe.

 



Quote:

Originally Posted by Holon View Post
Enneagram is even more Baby's First than the Baby's First Personality of Socionics. The roots are interesting, but R&H commercialised it and put it in competition with things it's not competitive against. Like actual personality science, or psychology/psychiatry. I suppose the magic is based on your choice of bricolage. Are you an enneagram shaman, or a psychiatry shaman? Pick your dead chicken.

People like it and find it credible because people like structuring narratives and are basically credulous, and are typically not exposed to the exciting world of things that do the Enneagram's job better than the Enneagram.

Brb, accepting ILI typing.

(As a history note, this site started as a way of connecting Oldham types and Socionics. Now look where we are. This forum has really gone downhill.)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jack Oliver Aaron View Post
Quote:

Originally Posted by mu4 View Post
Quote:

Originally Posted by Jack Oliver Aaron View Post
A large amount of traffic has moved to World Socionics Society on Facebook. There is a lot of daily discussion on there.

Naw, the discussions on WSS is amateur hour and this site has 2x the traffic vs 2011.

This site is focused on content translation and various content activities which allows for introduction of socionics information into the English speaking world.

Discussion can only be limited in quality due to the inadequacies of self-teaching opportunities.

Even if this site had no discussion there is still going to be a effort to provide the best possible content for individuals interested in this topic and to spread knowledge about this topic.

WSS has Expat, Rick (yup, he posted once), Bukalov, Reinin, Gulenko, Beskova, Eglit, Karpenko etc. you have Maritsa. :P

the16types was a great empire, but out of its ashes, a new society has been born!

You're a member of WSS now? I'd love to know who.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Persephone View Post
Looks like:
Oh I have a nice toy, it grew bigger over years.
And I have a super toy with super features that you don't have na!
An infantile fight duh.

Quote:

Originally Posted by InvisibleJim View Post
t16, onwards and upwards.





At best managing, patroning or possibly leading a terminal decline.

Quote:

Originally Posted by woofwoofl View Post
TinyChat has a limit to the amount of moderators that can be added to a room; if not for this, I would mod everyone. Due to the mod limit, there will be a power difference between the moderated and the non-moderated; this is always a problem. A MissingThePoint TinyChat, a Delta-quad TinyChat; these will have more focus than any one singular room can allow. Also remember the17th is the most stable room in this site's history, made initially as a refuge from the hell of chickenshack, where mod abuse went light-years beyond anything that ever happened in the16types or the17th. the17th reaching critical mass is enough to end any noise about the16types going downhill, discussion has simply moved to TC and expanded.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Subteigh View Post
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Originally Posted by ballistic gerbil View Post
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Originally Posted by jessica129 View Post
Quote:

Originally Posted by ballistic gerbil View Post
what elevation do you live at?

In all honesty, what significance does this have on our daily lives?

none. i've run out ideas. it's come to this.

This forum is really going downhill.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Abbie the Child View Post
I was just discussing the forum with Brilliand, and I mentioned that we were now low on Alphas (even with an Alpha owner), whereas in his day there were many Alphas and much theorizing. He suggested that the forum was going downhill, and I agreed, "Always going downhill, never reaching bottom." Because it's been "going downhill" for several years but doesn't change much as far as I see. Then Brilliand mentioned this:

Alphas discover.
Betas fight over.
Gammas make use of.
Deltas enjoy.

The age of the Alphas was the age of theorizing. Ideas kept being offered. Some were interesting, some were dumb, some were unnecessarily complicated. But the theory side of the theory blossomed.


I agreed that the age of Alphas was over. Brilliand figured that meant we were in the age of Betas now. But I proclaimed, "We're in the age of Gammas!" Because from what I see, the most common forumites are Gamma. And it didn't used to be that way. But Brilliand remembered the Age of Betas.

The age of the Betas was the age of conflict. Fighting. Drama. Remember that? It wasn't too long ago. Yes, there's still drama. There always has been. But I'm thinking of the time when people were heading up rebellions. There were factions.

The Age of the Gammas is what we have now. People aren't adding to the theory, and the fighting has died down. Now people are taking the theory and considering what can be made from it. Some charts? A new online test? A roleplay? We will see what comes out of the Age of Gammas.


So when most of the forumites are Delta, you'll know the forum is truly dying. ...or maybe the cycle will be renewed.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Abbie the Child View Post
Location sufficiently populated for interaction. Proceed.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skepsis View Post
Are there people not lured in by the logo of a dog about to attack an innocent child?!





Quote:

Originally Posted by Subteigh View Post
This forum is really going downhill. But that is the nature of the universe.

I would suggest that the forum moves to a new domain that has "socionics" in the title: I have at least one suggestion, although I won't mention it here because it may result in someone else acquiring it first.

Allowing people to log-on / register via facebook and twitter accounts may be a step forward.

I've also made the suggestion before that the header at the top of the forum (which has tabs labeled "Forum", "Articles", "Questionnaire", etc. should have "Tests" added to it. (Also: each Questionnaire page should urged people to take the questionnaire offline first before submitting it, to minimise the risk of the answers being lost by inadvertent log-outs etc.)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Abbie the Child View Post
I don't like the idea of connecting the forum to Facebook/twitter.

But if there is to be a test section, I would suggest these two:
http://sociotype.com/tests/
http://aimtoknow.com/test_beta


Quote:

Originally Posted by hag View Post
While I may seem like a blind optimist and a contrarian, I think this forum is really going uphill lately. Quality > quantity. I think relatively new members such as @Chae, @LuckyOne, @Economist, @Bertrand, @Wyrd, @Slugabed, @Horatio, and others are doing an excellent job of supplying interesting content (though the forum may not be as active as it once was).

I agree that the forum's outdated visual theme is probably deterring newcomers.

I also think that Discord probably has something to do with the dwindling shoutbox activity.

Quote:

Originally Posted by idontgiveaf View Post
This site is getting boring.

Like there's no much new posts :/

Can you guys posts something?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antennae View Post
socionics is dead praise Allah

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sol View Post
this site needs your fucks but...

Quote:

Originally Posted by FDG View Post
post some nudes, idontgiveafuck

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raver View Post
It has been extra boring lately. I am glad I am not the only one who has noticed. This forum used to have hostile drama every week in the early 2010s. I never thought the forum would die down this much.

Quote:

Originally Posted by idontgiveaf View Post
Quote:

Originally Posted by Baboooshka View Post
Just this SiTe?
Don't be silly.
SiTe is always boring :P

♡JkIloveyouSiAndTeUsers ♡

Lol that makes sense!!

Omggg!!!

Confirmed why this site is boring

Because si+Te

Lol xD

Quote:

Originally Posted by Subteigh View Post
If you find the site boring, you must be a bor...you must have a lower threshold for boredom.

Quote:

Originally Posted by strangeling View Post
I know, start a thread where people explain why a certain type fits certain stereotypes better than others. Lots of potential for shit-stirring and everything can be type-related!

No I don't know. I'm boring, so I can't help you...

Quote:

Originally Posted by wasp View Post
we need to organize a coup against a competing socionics forum

Quote:

Originally Posted by Baboooshka View Post
We need an uprising to make 16types great again. One which will be lead by the Betas of course, since they have wet dreams about this and were probably waiting for this to happen.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Suz View Post
Socionics now bores me, actually. It's not practically useful to me, because chances of mistypings are high. Who knows if socionics types are even truly real, anyway? We could just be hashing out emptiness. I no longer see a point to this bandwagon.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ouronis View Post

Quote:

Originally Posted by falsehope View Post
Social media is such rubbish. I know plenty of forums which died because people simply spend their time on facebook, instagram and so on now. Some are on reddit, but there's nothing much. On other forums there's almost no traffic. I think these people haven't went anywhere else, like different socionics forum, their attention is now focused on social media e.g. watching silly movies and clicking likes. There's no more intellectual debate for them. Now this forum is only for hardcore socionics fans. I bet we are all somewhat autistic so we need to categorize people. It seems that forums where mainly for people to engage in conversations and make friends and they have been to different forums based on interests. Now this friend seeking and general engagement is all taken over by facebook. Social media mainly cares about performance, more likes, more clicks, more of the feed, more advertisement and not the actual content. The only content rewarding website is google for the moment, so there will be still some people coming from there.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tallmo View Post
Learn Russian and join a Russian socionics forum. They are probably really good at this stuff.

хорошо!

Quote:

Originally Posted by thehotelambush View Post
Quote:

Originally Posted by falsehope View Post
Here's the map of interest in socionics:
https://trends.google.com/trends/exp...ll&q=socionics

It seems there's plenty of interest but some big countries like china doesn't have any interest at all. Maybe because they are firewalled. Anyway, there's more interest from US and even Canada then from Russia. But that's just google searching not actually scientific work or anything.

Here's the comparision to MBTI:
https://trends.google.com/trends/exp...socionics,mbti

It seems that MBTI is on average 30 to 50 times more popular except for Lithuania. Also, interest in socionics is at constant levels while interest in MBTI grows since 2013.

"Socionics" is an English word.

https://trends.google.com/trends/exp...B8%D0%BA%D0%B5

What I don't get is the popularity in Finland.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tallmo View Post
there is also another theory in sociology I think, that's called "Socionics", so what we call socionics might be even less

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tallmo View Post
Don't ask what the16types.info can do for you, but what you can do for the16types.info

Quote:

Originally Posted by lavos View Post
This site has turned into a television soap opera, or dragon ball. You can skip 5 episodes and you won't miss anything vital plot-wise.

Quote:

Originally Posted by chrys View Post
join a racial phrenology forum and try to type everyone instead of saying anything relevant to the forum's purpose (VI and describe to someone why they are a Beta (dont mention socionics just say that they are a Beta) instead of using words that describe DNA, family genetics, race, etc.)

https://www.theapricity.com/forum/ar...p/t-21944.html

https://theapricity.com/forum/forum.php

Quote:

Originally Posted by Subteigh View Post
This forum is really going downhill.

Quote:

Originally Posted by idontgiveaf View Post
Quote:

Originally Posted by thehotelambush View Post
Quote:

Originally Posted by starrangel View Post
Make 16types great again!

What would be GREAT is if we had more intellectual discussion and people who would actually take the time to watch a ten-minute interview and make insightful comments instead of declaring "SLI-Te sx/sp 592384239842 (final answer)". But nope, that's too much to ask. I guess you can have drama instead if you want.

Well typing ain't reliable either

Quote:

Originally Posted by thehotelambush View Post
Quote:

Originally Posted by Tommy View Post
But sometimes ppl get offended even with just that. I've been insulted by users just for saying them what type I think they are (in type me threads, btw). With those kind of reactions, I dont even want to invest time in trying to explain why. Some have told me that I'm "offending them" also for doing it, so, what to do? This matter is not just one sided in all cases. If ppl is going to open a " type me" thread but they dont even want to know others opinions, then why I should even bother?

If they ask for typings then they have no right to get offended. But you can still type celebrities.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bertrand View Post
yeah trying to explain just gets written off as offensive trolling or engaging in "battletyping" anyway. if you take it a step further dumping a "SLI-Te sx/sp 592384239842 (final answer)" is equally stupid, so the real point here is I think people should be less defensive unless they want people to not talk about it all (I think you can actually infer this as a subconscious motive much of the time). you can say these dump and runs are directed at third parties but "battletyping" is engaging with someone directly, but its all the same analysis such that they implicate eachother anyway, one just involves a person who is here to "hear" it. why people think knowledge is going to develop while simultaneously tip toeing around people's sentiments seems strange to me. the two are manifestly at odds whenever any opinions differ, and if the controlling factor is who is in the room the truth loses all meaning

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bertrand View Post
people always say stuff like "man these forums really have gone downhill"

then its like, wow I wish this really productive poster was still around

"nah we don't need people worship"

its like okay, well

Quote:

Originally Posted by Delilah View Post
Well i've been in the forum in the years before 2010 and recall it was a much more productive place in terms of discussion and getting feedback from people. I think that compared to then it has gone downhill. I was only on and off on the forum in 2010 so don't recall it well what it was like then. Anyway, Raver - if i'm not mistaken - too has been in the forum prior to 2010 so i don't know what he thinks of those earlier years (which, again, to me seemed the forum was more conducive to productive discussion back then). Just imo

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raver View Post
Yeah, the golden years for Socionics discussion in this forum was 2006-2009 for sure. There were heavyweights around then that really knew their stuff like Expat among several others. 2010-2014 was the drama years, every week there was something new for people to fight about and Socionics discussion was decent, but most of it was non-Socionics related. The modern era of this forum (2015-2018) has similar drama of 2006-2009, but without the high quality Socionics discussions basically.

So if you were looking for high quality Socionics dicussions then 2006-2009 was the time to be active in this forum, if you were looking for entertainment with intense and vicious drama then 2010-2014 was the time for that and if you were looking for a place to sit back and relax to discuss Socionics casually with the occasional mostly light hearted drama then 2015-2018 was the time for that. I took several breaks that lasted either months or even years, but that's the gist of what I got from my time in the forum.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mclane View Post
A lot of people lurk this forum, but the interaction has really gone downhill. Most of the socionics interaction occurs now on the Facebook socionics groups. There are some very intelligent people there.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ballistic gerbil View Post
this forum is going downhill.

Quote:

Originally Posted by squark View Post
Always always downhill into the abyss

21 Savage

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